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Post by ZanderX10 on Apr 5, 2017 13:38:15 GMT
Back to the topic.... If this hero works in the same principle like KQ then I would try to build a deck that is more offensive based and let to my deck to take some damage. If i use any defensive skill it would be rampart, block, or FA. Creatures with dodge are banned. For rage control: I don't see the reason to use Aquarius since the hero skill will deal with the rage manipulation and I try to believe that once his skill it's activated then it will keep the enemy hero rage down for two round which might be enough to obtain full rage again. So some QT should be enough The hero talents would be Lucidity + Full alert I definitely consider this new hero a top tier one. And interesting to see a new hero working in a different way. I would like to see his skill at level 10. Any idea? Why Full Alert? Would Full Alert + your creatures with Frost Armor = 0 damage received? We still don't know if this is considered a successful attack or not. that is a successful attack. Frost blade still works with 0 atk as well as osmose.
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Post by barleylime on Apr 5, 2017 13:40:07 GMT
My biggest problem with this heros skill, apart from it hinging on basic attacks by the enemy creatures to work, is that, while rage loss is still anoyying, they would be effecting rage AFTER their hero would have already activated it's skill. Their attack phases all trail their hero skill activation so they would be trying to lower an empty rage bar. If his skill inflicted hp reduction instead of direct dmg it would balance out by being able to still compete with druidess' wards. As it is now, it is extremely lackluster compared to other heroes and other forms of rage manipulation. Why do you say " ... they would be effecting rage AFTER their hero would have already activated it's skill. Their attack phases all trail their hero skill activation so they would be trying to lower an empty rage bar." Let's say enemy hero is Warbringer. I cast Cinder Blight on enemy creatures. When my turn ends, then enemy turn begins. Maybe at this time Warbringer rage is only 75%? So his creatures make successful basic attacks and reduces Warbringer's rage. I agree that in situations whereby enemy Hero fires off the skill first, then only its creatures attacks... then yea, Cinder Blight becomes useless in terms of reducing enemy hero rage. There's still a consolation of the damage dealt to the hero though.
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Post by barleylime on Apr 5, 2017 13:42:54 GMT
Why Full Alert? Would Full Alert + your creatures with Frost Armor = 0 damage received? We still don't know if this is considered a successful attack or not. that is a successful attack. Frost blade still works with 0 atk as well as osmose. But Stabthrough does not work if the damage is zero, even if I equip with the Stabthrough rune.
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#da2020
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ZanderX10
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Post by ZanderX10 on Apr 5, 2017 13:44:05 GMT
My biggest problem with this heros skill, apart from it hinging on basic attacks by the enemy creatures to work, is that, while rage loss is still anoyying, they would be effecting rage AFTER their hero would have already activated it's skill. Their attack phases all trail their hero skill activation so they would be trying to lower an empty rage bar. If his skill inflicted hp reduction instead of direct dmg it would balance out by being able to still compete with druidess' wards. As it is now, it is extremely lackluster compared to other heroes and other forms of rage manipulation. Why do you say " ... they would be effecting rage AFTER their hero would have already activated it's skill. Their attack phases all trail their hero skill activation so they would be trying to lower an empty rage bar." Let's say enemy hero is Warbringer. I cast Cinder Blight on enemy creatures. When my turn ends, then enemy turn begins. Maybe at this time Warbringer rage is only 75%? So his creatures make successful basic attacks and reduces Warbringer's rage. I agree that in situations whereby enemy Hero fires off the skill first, then only its creatures attacks... then yea, Cinder Blight becomes useless in terms of reducing enemy hero rage. There's still a consolation of the damage dealt to the hero though. I meant that it is a waste if the enemy hero has full rage at the start of the turn after you cast cinder spirits skill. If you have board presence then it's safe to say you dealt alot of dmg on your turn. It's not a huge leap to think they could have filled the rage bar from your onslaught. I feel like it has diminishing returns if you are already winning.
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Post by Sinister22✪NFS on Apr 5, 2017 13:45:38 GMT
that is a successful attack. Frost blade still works with 0 atk as well as osmose. But Stabthrough does not work if the damage is zero, even if I equip with the Stabthrough rune. It is because of damage computation. Anything you multiply with 0 will be 0.
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Post by barleylime on Apr 5, 2017 13:49:02 GMT
But Stabthrough does not work if the damage is zero, even if I equip with the Stabthrough rune. It is because of damage computation. Anything you multiply with 0 will be 0. And "block or full alert" + "frost armor" is also 0, correct?
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#da2020
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Post by ZanderX10 on Apr 5, 2017 13:53:52 GMT
It is because of damage computation. Anything you multiply with 0 will be 0. And "block or full alert" + "frost armor" is also 0, correct? yes. As long as full alert or block is greater than or equal to the frost armor value.
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Post by barleylime on Apr 5, 2017 14:08:06 GMT
Why Full Alert? Would Full Alert + your creatures with Frost Armor = 0 damage received? We still don't know if this is considered a successful attack or not. that is a successful attack. Frost blade still works with 0 atk as well as osmose. But Stabthrough does not work if the damage is zero, even if I equip with the Stabthrough rune. It is because of damage computation. Anything you multiply with 0 will be 0. Lets track back a little. The Stabthrough rune states "an additional damage equal to % of enemy Hero's health". So even if basic damage is zero, it shouldn't stop the rune from dealing % damage based on enemy Hero's health, correct? Do you mean that when basic damage is zero, then skills such as Frost Blade and Osmose will still proc, but rune effects will not proc?
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#da2020
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Post by ZanderX10 on Apr 5, 2017 14:19:28 GMT
that is a successful attack. Frost blade still works with 0 atk as well as osmose. It is because of damage computation. Anything you multiply with 0 will be 0. Lets track back a little. The Stabthrough rune states "an additional damage equal to % of enemy Hero's health". So even if basic damage is zero, it shouldn't stop the rune from dealing % damage based on enemy Hero's health, correct? Do you mean that when basic damage is zero, then skills such as Frost Blade and Osmose will still proc, but rune effects will not proc? not sure in regards to stabthrough. But on the topic of runes, frost blade rune procs even if frostblade fails. It just has to perform a basic attack. This would need some testing. I can't do it anytime soon but the best way to test would be to have a friend set their deck with a couple of low atk fa crits with a hero that has cripple. Then you can practice fight them with a stabthrough creature with the rune.
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Post by Sinister22✪NFS on Apr 5, 2017 14:20:51 GMT
that is a successful attack. Frost blade still works with 0 atk as well as osmose. It is because of damage computation. Anything you multiply with 0 will be 0. Lets track back a little. The Stabthrough rune states "an additional damage equal to % of enemy Hero's health". So even if basic damage is zero, it shouldn't stop the rune from dealing % damage based on enemy Hero's health, correct? Do you mean that when basic damage is zero, then skills such as Frost Blade and Osmose will still proc, but rune effects will not proc? I am sorry I have to correct myself there. Since the damage is zero, the computation for the damage will be stopped immediately and thus will not add the additional damage. The difference is the effect of both. While stabthrough provides only "additional" damage, other runes such as frost blade and Osmose will take effect because the runes are "effect" runes rather than damage inflicting ones.
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#da2020
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ZanderX10
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Post by ZanderX10 on Apr 5, 2017 14:26:57 GMT
Lets track back a little. The Stabthrough rune states "an additional damage equal to % of enemy Hero's health". So even if basic damage is zero, it shouldn't stop the rune from dealing % damage based on enemy Hero's health, correct? Do you mean that when basic damage is zero, then skills such as Frost Blade and Osmose will still proc, but rune effects will not proc? I am sorry I have to correct myself there. Since the damage is zero, the computation for the damage will be stopped immediately and thus will not add the additional damage. The difference is the effect of both. While stabthrough provides only "additional" damage, other runes such as frost blade and Osmose will take effect because the runes are "effect" runes rather than damage inflicting ones. I know that stabthrough itself will be nulled by 0 atk but i havnt actually seen wether or not the rune works. Your explanation makes perfect sense. The only reason I add anything to the post is that igg doesn't always follow sound logic on coding so I still have a shred of doubt as to wether it would function as presumed.
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Post by barleylime on Apr 5, 2017 14:33:14 GMT
I am sorry I have to correct myself there. Since the damage is zero, the computation for the damage will be stopped immediately and thus will not add the additional damage. The difference is the effect of both. While stabthrough provides only "additional" damage, other runes such as frost blade and Osmose will take effect because the runes are "effect" runes rather than damage inflicting ones. I am sorry I have to correct myself there. Since the damage is zero, the computation for the damage will be stopped immediately and thus will not add the additional damage. The difference is the effect of both. While stabthrough provides only "additional" damage, other runes such as frost blade and Osmose will take effect because the runes are "effect" runes rather than damage inflicting ones. I know that stabthrough itself will be nulled by 0 atk but i havnt actually seen wether or not the rune works. Your explanation makes perfect sense. The only reason I add anything to the post is that igg doesn't always follow sound logic on coding so I still have a shred of doubt as to wether it would function as presumed. Thanks both for trying to explain. I don't want to go too deep thinking about what is a successful basic attack. I'll just sit back and relax and just enjoy the game.
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Post by theonehundred on Apr 5, 2017 18:55:31 GMT
another carrot for the whales. Whales dont eat carrots! They eat fish and hoomans. lots and lots of hoomans! what's a hooman?
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#da2020
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Post by ZanderX10 on Apr 5, 2017 19:00:12 GMT
Whales dont eat carrots! They eat fish and hoomans. lots and lots of hoomans! what's a hooman? they are the gods of the doggos. The source of belly scrubbies and tasty yummos.
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Post by theonehundred on Apr 5, 2017 19:03:11 GMT
what's doggo, scrubbies, and yummo?
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Post by Sinister22✪NFS on Apr 6, 2017 5:41:24 GMT
what's doggo, scrubbies, and yummo? A doggo is a species of cute cudly but ferocious animales belonging to the caninimalingus specie. native to the dwellings of hoomans. Scrubbies and yummos are forms of life giving substance normally seen and made by hoomans in their ground lairs and specific places native to their dwellings. Have you not heard of them? Anyway Cinder Spirit is awesome.
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Yuna
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Post by Yuna on Apr 6, 2017 6:15:35 GMT
Back to the topic.... If this hero works in the same principle like KQ then I would try to build a deck that is more offensive based and let to my deck to take some damage. If i use any defensive skill it would be rampart, block, or FA. Creatures with dodge are banned. For rage control: I don't see the reason to use Aquarius since the hero skill will deal with the rage manipulation and I try to believe that once his skill it's activated then it will keep the enemy hero rage down for two round which might be enough to obtain full rage again. So some QT should be enough The hero talents would be Lucidity + Full alert I definitely consider this new hero a top tier one. And interesting to see a new hero working in a different way. I would like to see his skill at level 10. Any idea? Why Full Alert? Would Full Alert + your creatures with Frost Armor = 0 damage received? We still don't know if this is considered a successful attack or not. It is a successful basic attack. Skills that require successful basic attacks only require them to actually go off and hit an enemy creature. Dodging, Ice Coffining does not count, but FA:ing or being immune to basic damage (Virgo/Virgil) does. For example, unless I'm misremembering, a Queen Temptress with 0 ATK will still steal up to 25 Rage if she hits the opposing hero.
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nips
Stormkalar
90%
Posts: 20
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December 2016
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Post by nips on Apr 27, 2017 5:07:15 GMT
Here is my upgraded Cinder Spirit in the link below. His skill is a little underwhelming as I see it right now but I will need to play around with the right deck. ibb.co/eVv3kk
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nips
Stormkalar
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Posts: 20
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Post by nips on Apr 27, 2017 5:10:12 GMT
See the upgraded image below. Still working on a deck that would go well with him but right now its a little underwhelming. Feel free to give suggestions. ibb.co/eVv3kk
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Post by ℒ✰Deer on Apr 27, 2017 5:49:31 GMT
Here is my upgraded Cinder Spirit in the link below. His skill is a little underwhelming as I see it right now but I will need to play around with the right deck. ibb.co/eVv3kkSo probably at level 10 the enemy rage is reduced by 15 and makes 100% damage Has anyone seen it in action? Because I am still doubting that "Successful basic attack reduce the Rage of enemy hero" is the successful basic attack of the enemy creatures.
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#ff3008
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Post by Sinister22✪NFS on Apr 27, 2017 6:08:36 GMT
In theory the sisters would be beneficial since basic attacks would connect but against dodge based decks it might be a bit trick. It also requires you to have a lot of immunity for you creatures to successfully attack without being CC'd. Sweeping blow is another good one if it connects.
My best bet on this is a bunch of runed bb8 graboid or a sac soul shrew. The direct damage and the number of creatures hit would benefit a lot on your part.
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nips
Stormkalar
90%
Posts: 20
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Post by nips on Apr 27, 2017 7:04:46 GMT
Yes, its my card so ive used it. It indeed procs when the enemy creature has a basic attack on my creature or hero. It reduces the rage and hits the enemy hero for damage.
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Psalm 18:33
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Post by ℒ✰Deer on Apr 27, 2017 7:16:37 GMT
Yes, its my card so ive used it. It indeed procs when the enemy creature has a basic attack on my creature or hero. It reduces the rage and hits the enemy hero for damage. Congrats to your hero. Can it beat druidess? What talents are you using? Does it have any special one? Also, would you mind adding me to your friend list? I would like to see it in action?
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Post by Sinister22✪NFS on Apr 27, 2017 7:47:31 GMT
Yes, its my card so ive used it. It indeed procs when the enemy creature has a basic attack on my creature or hero. It reduces the rage and hits the enemy hero for damage. So you mean to say NOT your creatures attack procs it and instead it procs when your enemy has basic attack?
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Post by opalnera on Apr 27, 2017 8:04:08 GMT
Yes, its my card so ive used it. It indeed procs when the enemy creature has a basic attack on my creature or hero. It reduces the rage and hits the enemy hero for damage. So it procs when enemy cards has a succesfull basic atacks. So your cards gets damaged and then the same card beats his own hero and takes away rage? If thats the case then its a mediocore hero and does nothing to help u defeat your opponent cards. I see it last 4 turns on lvl 6 so the only 2 things happens is. 1. Opponent hero could be destroyed by his own cards. 2. Basic attacks takes away opponent hero rage. So against druidess he has no more chance to win as all other heroes. Except that he has 1 more way to rage control your opponent hero.
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#000000
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Post by Nafai✪APeXNFS on Apr 27, 2017 8:18:56 GMT
Against Druidess he can be good because druidess will never launch skill.
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Bring it on !!!
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Post by razor on Apr 27, 2017 8:44:42 GMT
Against Druidess he can be good because druidess will never launch skill. It can be good against any hero I m waiting to see one being played .....draaktoure ....bring in the heat
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Post by barleylime on Apr 27, 2017 9:12:19 GMT
In theory this Hero could be good against Druidess. It's a shame that the skill lasts for only 2 turns. Would have been great if Cinder Blight lasts until the enemy creature dies.
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Psalm 18:33
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Post by ℒ✰Deer on Apr 27, 2017 9:24:27 GMT
His skill last 4 round which is plenty I believe but the stupid thing is you must not kill the enemy creatures or just do it very slowly. + You can't use dodge or group tactics or creatures with any lock down skill. Except maybe Virgo and creatures that can take a lot's of abuse like queen artolia
To me this hero would make much more sense if the rage reduction happens after a successful basic attack of MINE creatures.
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Post by Sinister22✪NFS on Apr 27, 2017 9:38:04 GMT
together with runed stab swordmasters this will be a good hero killer.
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