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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 13:15:03 GMT
Time to move on guys. TW server update in about 1.5 days. Changelog soon.
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 13:28:44 GMT
Checked the changelog, stab nerf seems to be minor. It's still going to be good.
By the initial looks, PvP stab is still going to be decent, but not as good as before, but every deck still needs to have some kind of hero kill counter. Good balance for PvP. Stab got pretty big nerf for PvE though (trials/dungeon maps).
Player level cap increased to 110 as well. Some captivator bug fix again. Grimoire magic system.
Will add more once they are more accurately confirmed.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2015 13:33:59 GMT
So whats the exactly nerf?
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Post by drakkan on Sept 21, 2015 13:36:28 GMT
And what does the Grimoire do?
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 13:37:59 GMT
So whats the exactly nerf? Waiting till one of my guild mates come to do a more accurate game translation. My poor skills say that the max damage is reduced from 2000 to 1000. But there seems to be some hero (hp) changes, possibly higher base hero hp (through grimoire?).
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2015 13:53:23 GMT
Ok thanks. Please update us !
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 15:07:48 GMT
I think it's stabthrough is done for once you reach trials 105+ and map 13+. If EN patch is the same as TW patch, hero vigor runes add 10x more hero hp. So a Lv5 5* hero vigor will add 50k hero hp.
RIP stabthrough 2015?
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 15:17:09 GMT
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 15:25:00 GMT
[New Contents] 1. New Mine System 2. New time limited BUFF System (something new, not heist) 3. New Grimoire System 4. Player Level cap increase to 110
[Improvement] 1. Vitality, Violence, Protean Runes stat increases 50% 2. Hero Vigor Rune stat increase 10x 3. Hero Skill "Butcher" dmg increase 60% 4. Stab through rune dmg cap decrease from 2000 to 1000 5. Creature skill "soul swap(?)" adjusted to not activate under charm state. 6. Creature skill "Bless" & "Curse" skill effect upper limit increase to 1000 (probably capped at 1k due hero vigor runes adding alot in %)
[Bug Fixes] 1. Unable to collect Login reward bug fix 2. Creature [Undying Will, Fae Firstborn] on death creature counts fix 3. Creature skill "Harder you work, harder you gain (?)" adjusted to not activate when receiving continual dmg 4. Creature skill "Star falls" adjusted to receive boost from Sorcery rune effect 5. Hero skill "Light Foot or Group Tactic not sure which one it is referring" to be affected by Nightslayer's Onslaught skill 6. Fixed bug where creature under crazed sorrow state when their basic attack is dodged, crazed state is not clear. It will now be cleared even if basic attack is dodged.
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 15:47:37 GMT
There were few occasions that the EN server was different than TW server, I think they are making stab close to useless. A hero vigor stat increase of 5k would make stab still decent but not useless. Especially with the captivator nerf. Now we wait for the EN announcement.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2015 16:13:58 GMT
Captivator nerf? which ability does they nerf on him?
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Post by drakkan on Sept 21, 2015 16:20:36 GMT
Vitality rune x10 .. so Hero with 20.000 + 50.000HP .. will have major impact on guild maps .. ?
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Post by ninjafred on Sept 21, 2015 16:41:43 GMT
There were few occasions that the EN server was different than TW server, I think they are making stab close to useless. A hero vigor stat increase of 5k would make stab still decent but not useless. Especially with the captivator nerf. Now we wait for the EN announcement. Well, I partly disagree with you Naruto. Most heroes you have to face are around 40.000 HP, don't they ? So 1000 damage by Stab rune is 2.5% which is the bonus you get with a lvl5 stab rune. Much less than it used to be but still pretty well compared to curse or Godwill. Yes the upgrade will nerf Stab in PVP for top500 players, most of them will get a leveled Hero vigor rune and will be our of reach of a 'small' stab deck and still quite hard for an 'elaborate' stab deck. But in Explo or Gauntlet Stab Decks will still be performing - except if IGG decides that some new Explo maps or Gauntlet decks get Runes, which is unclear. Stab decks will have to be better 'tuned' and most of the time it won't be necessary to upgrade stab runes above lvl 6 or 7, but I think it will still be a decent deck.
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Post by ninjafred on Sept 21, 2015 16:47:55 GMT
Vitality rune x10 .. so Hero with 20.000 + 50.000HP .. will have major impact on guild maps .. ? Yes it will ... And not only in Guild maps ofc
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 21, 2015 16:51:34 GMT
There were few occasions that the EN server was different than TW server, I think they are making stab close to useless. A hero vigor stat increase of 5k would make stab still decent but not useless. Especially with the captivator nerf. Now we wait for the EN announcement. Well, I partly disagree with you Naruto. Most heroes you have to face are around 40.000 HP, don't they ? So 1000 damage by Stab rune is 2.5% which is the bonus you get with a lvl5 stab rune. Much less than it used to be but still pretty well compared to curse or Godwill. Yes the upgrade will nerf Stab in PVP for top500 players, most of them will get a leveled Hero vigor rune and will be our of reach of a 'small' stab deck and still quite hard for an 'elaborate' stab deck. But in Explo or Gauntlet Stab Decks will still be performing - except if IGG decides that some new Explo maps or Gauntlet decks get Runes, which is unclear. Stab decks will have to be better 'tuned' and most of the time it won't be necessary to upgrade stab runes above lvl 6 or 7, but I think it will still be a decent deck. Check my previous post. I wrote stab will be useful for clearing up to map 12 and trials 100 where they are no runes used. The gauntlet is a good one though.
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Post by stuuu✪NFS on Sept 21, 2015 16:59:40 GMT
So whats the exactly nerf? Waiting till one of my guild mates come to do a more accurate game translation. My poor skills say that the max damage is reduced from 2000 to 1000. But there seems to be some hero (hp) changes, possibly higher base hero hp (through grimoire?). Good think I have 8 Lvl 9 stab runes...
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Post by voldrox [BK] on Sept 21, 2015 17:08:29 GMT
I have three V Hero vigor runes. Man they sound so useful now.
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Post by sonbalin on Sept 21, 2015 19:50:40 GMT
6. Creature skill "Bless" & "Curse" skill effect upper limit increase to 1000 (probably capped at 1k due hero vigor runes adding alot in %) This is odd as I'm pretty sure both Bless and Curse can go over 1000 anyway? Edit - Nevermind, your comment in brackets actually explains this.
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Post by storyteller on Sept 21, 2015 21:06:15 GMT
[New Contents] 1. New Mine System 2. New time limited BUFF System (something new, not heist) 3. New Grimoire System 4. Player Level cap increase to 110 [Improvement] 1. Vitality, Violence, Protean Runes stat increases 50% 2. Hero Vigor Rune stat increase 10x 3. Hero Skill "Butcher" dmg increase 60% 4. Stab through rune dmg cap decrease from 2000 to 1000 5. Creature skill "soul swap(?)" adjusted to not activate under charm state. 6. Creature skill "Bless" & "Curse" skill effect upper limit increase to 1000 (probably capped at 1k due hero vigor runes adding alot in %) [Bug Fixes] 1. Unable to collect Login reward bug fix 2. Creature [Undying Will, Fae Firstborn] on death creature counts fix 3. Creature skill "Harder you work, harder you gain (?)" adjusted to not activate when receiving continual dmg 4. Creature skill "Star falls" adjusted to receive boost from Sorcery rune effect 5. Hero skill "Light Foot or Group Tactic not sure which one it is referring" to be affected by Nightslayer's Onslaught skill 6. Fixed bug where creature under crazed sorrow state when their basic attack is dodged, crazed state is not clear. It will now be cleared even if basic attack is dodged. Thanks to Naruto for keeping us abreast of the changes coming. Really appreciate this so I can allocate resources wisely. I have some questions if you know how some of this is getting worked out on the TW server. There seems a lot of potential for this "balance" on stabthrough to unbalance other aspects of the game. For example, if hero vigor runes increase health at that level, do I no longer need oracle to do massive damage on guild maps? Actually, if heroes have that much health, maybe that's good, as a lot of other strategies might be useful, like Zora for instance. Or maybe no strategy at all is really needed, and you can throw almost anything into a guild map now. Zora with a couple frost ragers melded with bless could wreak havok now. Also, how is this going to affect the summoning heroes? Part of the attractiveness of summoning heroes is the way that their summons could tank damage. Since it is hero health that is being raised, but stab still does good damage, the summons loses much of its utility. I'm almost done with my captivator, so I'm wondering if the crazed sorrow still lasts on a creature until it has attacked, i.e. does it still last more than one turn if the creature is delayed? Seems like if bug fix 6 is how they are addressing this, that it is the way they want it that crazed sorrow will persist until an attack. Finally, any details on the new grimoire system? Sorry for all the questions, but I appreciate any answers that you (or anyone else) has!
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Post by sonbalin on Sept 21, 2015 21:18:53 GMT
[New Contents] 1. New Mine System 2. New time limited BUFF System (something new, not heist) 3. New Grimoire System 4. Player Level cap increase to 110 [Improvement] 1. Vitality, Violence, Protean Runes stat increases 50% 2. Hero Vigor Rune stat increase 10x 3. Hero Skill "Butcher" dmg increase 60% 4. Stab through rune dmg cap decrease from 2000 to 1000 5. Creature skill "soul swap(?)" adjusted to not activate under charm state. 6. Creature skill "Bless" & "Curse" skill effect upper limit increase to 1000 (probably capped at 1k due hero vigor runes adding alot in %) [Bug Fixes] 1. Unable to collect Login reward bug fix 2. Creature [Undying Will, Fae Firstborn] on death creature counts fix 3. Creature skill "Harder you work, harder you gain (?)" adjusted to not activate when receiving continual dmg 4. Creature skill "Star falls" adjusted to receive boost from Sorcery rune effect 5. Hero skill "Light Foot or Group Tactic not sure which one it is referring" to be affected by Nightslayer's Onslaught skill 6. Fixed bug where creature under crazed sorrow state when their basic attack is dodged, crazed state is not clear. It will now be cleared even if basic attack is dodged. Thanks to Naruto for keeping us abreast of the changes coming. Really appreciate this so I can allocate resources wisely. I have some questions if you know how some of this is getting worked out on the TW server. There seems a lot of potential for this "balance" on stabthrough to unbalance other aspects of the game. For example, if hero vigor runes increase health at that level, do I no longer need oracle to do massive damage on guild maps? Actually, if heroes have that much health, maybe that's good, as a lot of other strategies might be useful, like Zora for instance. Or maybe no strategy at all is really needed, and you can throw almost anything into a guild map now. Zora with a couple frost ragers melded with bless could wreak havok now. Also, how is this going to affect the summoning heroes? Part of the attractiveness of summoning heroes is the way that their summons could tank damage. Since it is hero health that is being raised, but stab still does good damage, the summons loses much of its utility. I'm almost done with my captivator, so I'm wondering if the crazed sorrow still lasts on a creature until it has attacked, i.e. does it still last more than one turn if the creature is delayed? Seems like if bug fix 6 is how they are addressing this, that it is the way they want it that crazed sorrow will persist until an attack. Finally, any details on the new grimoire system? Sorry for all the questions, but I appreciate any answers that you (or anyone else) has! I can't say how things are on TW server but some of that is explained by game mechanics anyway. For Guild Maps, Blood Curse is the enemy talent that damages your hero. it does 500+5% max hero health as hero damage. This means the damage to your hero scales with HP so you will still need Oracles. A 70k HP hero will takes 4000 damage per round from Blood Curse for example, remember Bless is now capped at 1000 hero HP restored. Summoner heroes will be weakened by using a Hero Vigor rune, possibly more due to Curse than Stabthrough though. There summons will obviously be taking much more damage and will be pretty much completely useless on Guild Maps. Using the rune is a choice though. Not sure on the others as they obviously require more info or experience on TW server.
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Post by storyteller on Sept 21, 2015 22:14:21 GMT
Thanks for the answers sonbalin. Yeah, I should have thought about blood curse being % of hero health. Now there might be reason to have a separate hero for guild map, to maximize the relative effectiveness of oracles.
That brings up another potential balance issue with the Godswill rune when a hero with the hero vigor rune attacks one without. I wonder if the damage will be based on your hero's health.
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Post by sonbalin on Sept 21, 2015 22:59:45 GMT
I've been thinking about Godswill too - I'm hoping they just missed the patch note on that.
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Post by Jan<(3 on Sept 22, 2015 9:08:46 GMT
I have bad feelings about this. Game maps would be so easy with hero vitality rune which gave 50 k hp. Everyone knows that if you use wight, so propably in the next patch wight will be nerf too. Sad, because he isnt most powerful hero in pvp, but very strong in guild map. Propably he become stroner and everything all of the vitality runes. Sorry for my english, Im just confused with that fact of runes and nerf stabtrough. I clear dungeons to 13-4 without stab deck and almost month ago i started to collect this kind of cards, propably i will never finish 13 stage ;/
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Post by ninjafred on Sept 22, 2015 10:13:36 GMT
I have bad feelings about this. Game maps would be so easy with hero vitality rune which gave 50 k hp. Everyone knows that if you use wight, so propably in the next patch wight will be nerf too. Sad, because he isnt most powerful hero in pvp, but very strong in guild map. Propably he become stroner and everything all of the vitality runes. Sorry for my english, Im just confused with that fact of runes and nerf stabtrough. I clear dungeons to 13-4 without stab deck and almost month ago i started to collect this kind of cards, propably i will never finish 13 stage ;/ I think that if IGG had the intention to nerf Wight, this would have been done months ago ...
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Post by drakkan on Sept 22, 2015 12:45:13 GMT
I have bad feelings about this. Game maps would be so easy with hero vitality rune which gave 50 k hp. Everyone knows that if you use wight, so propably in the next patch wight will be nerf too. Sad, because he isnt most powerful hero in pvp, but very strong in guild map. Propably he become stroner and everything all of the vitality runes. Sorry for my english, Im just confused with that fact of runes and nerf stabtrough. I clear dungeons to 13-4 without stab deck and almost month ago i started to collect this kind of cards, propably i will never finish 13 stage ;/ Well there is an interesting new strategy (for maps without loads of immunity) -> use Hero with 70.000HP (royal guard for ability), 5x Flame Brave runed as much as you can, and sorrcery rune. Wait until all 10 creatures are put .. then release your Flame Brave army .. Or similar stuff with spikey bits .. wait until all 10 creatures are on board, then spikey bits x3 for the win .. even better than Flame Braves
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 22, 2015 14:57:41 GMT
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Post by ℜ★Naruto on Sept 22, 2015 15:27:51 GMT
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Post by Ominous on Sept 22, 2015 16:00:00 GMT
Oooh buying 5* creature and hero shards - I like the look of that! (obviously depending on how you get those crystal things)
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Post by storyteller on Sept 22, 2015 21:35:22 GMT
I have bad feelings about this. Game maps would be so easy with hero vitality rune which gave 50 k hp. Everyone knows that if you use wight, so propably in the next patch wight will be nerf too. Sad, because he isnt most powerful hero in pvp, but very strong in guild map. Propably he become stroner and everything all of the vitality runes. Sorry for my english, Im just confused with that fact of runes and nerf stabtrough. I clear dungeons to 13-4 without stab deck and almost month ago i started to collect this kind of cards, propably i will never finish 13 stage ;/ Well there is an interesting new strategy (for maps without loads of immunity) -> use Hero with 70.000HP (royal guard for ability), 5x Flame Brave runed as much as you can, and sorrcery rune. Wait until all 10 creatures are put .. then release your Flame Brave army .. Or similar stuff with spikey bits .. wait until all 10 creatures are on board, then spikey bits x3 for the win .. even better than Flame Braves I think they will soon need to rebalance of the rebalance because of things like this. I don't want to get much into the stabthrough nerf (enough of that in the other thread!), but increasing hero health so much takes away one of the win/lose mechanics, leaving only the defeating of all creatures. And like you guys point out, you can just sit back with your hero and let the hero do most of the damage (wight) or easily wait until all the creatures are out for spiky bits. Not sure why they didn't just lower the damage from the rune, because increasing hero health throws off so many other things. There are so many ways to abuse the increase to hero health. I'm really hesitant to commit too much to any particular strategy now until we see how things settle out. Generally, I'm going to work on improving my "keep board control" kind of deck. On the plus side, some of the additions they are making that we can see in Naruto's video look really interesting.
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Post by OuchDamage✪NFS on Sept 22, 2015 21:52:59 GMT
Im speculating that the hero hp boost has something to do with the new event or new feature called grimoire. Just speculations though.
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