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Post by squirreleyez on Aug 30, 2017 13:40:19 GMT
Rage generation formula. Has anybody attempted to figure this out? What factors play into rage generation? The reason why I'm asking this is trying to create a condition where your hero power could still fire off after taking a hit from RQT, for example.
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Post by chyj4747 on Aug 30, 2017 14:06:45 GMT
I'm curious too. I'm trying to make a simulator of DH for helping build decks. Currently I just know that even the damage is too low, hero will still gain 1 rage.
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#8f0a7f
ApexNFS Guild
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NFS✪Grandfather
Madness, as you know, is a lot like gravity; all it takes is a little push.
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Post by NFS✪Grandfather on Aug 30, 2017 15:30:50 GMT
Hero wont gain rage if basic attack deals 0 damage which is not case that often so if have voodoo card with voodoo rune on far right side on board you could avoid enemy hero rage even after attack if voodoo rune is on high enough level and if your attack is not too strong. So its tricky but of happens you will have good advantage in battle.
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Post by squirreleyez on Aug 30, 2017 16:39:04 GMT
Hero wont gain rage if basic attack deals 0 damage which is not case that often so if have voodoo card with voodoo rune on far right side on board you could avoid enemy hero rage even after attack if voodoo rune is on high enough level and if your attack is not too strong. So its tricky but of happens you will have good advantage in battle. I've noticed this too after being affected by blade shard
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Post by nemesisdestroyer on Aug 31, 2017 13:02:05 GMT
Rage gained is affected on damage dealt per % of max HP(of crit or Hero attacked). test hit same Hero with and without Health rune to see the difference in rage gain, using same creatuee. also test it crit vs crit, using Vigor rune and then remove it, using same creature as attacker with same attk. So this means not using Hero Vigor rune and dont have a lot of max HP on crits will generate you more Rage!
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Post by squirreleyez on Aug 31, 2017 17:19:26 GMT
Rage gained is affected on damage dealt per % of max HP(of crit or Hero attacked). test hit same Hero with and without Health rune to see the difference in rage gain, using same creatuee. also test it crit vs crit, using Vigor rune and then remove it, using same creature as attacker with same attk. So this means not using Hero Vigor rune and dont have a lot of max HP on crits will generate you more Rage! WOW! That is good to know. Okay sounds like you did the test... what's your best guess about what the health:rage generation ratio is on both Hero and crits?
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Post by ZanderX10 on Aug 31, 2017 21:17:22 GMT
I think it's 1:1%
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Post by squirreleyez on Sept 1, 2017 13:45:11 GMT
If you're talking about damage taken to hero, do you mean 1% damage to max hp will result in a 1 point rage increase? I'm not sure what you are referring to
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Post by ZanderX10 on Sept 1, 2017 15:52:17 GMT
If you're talking about damage taken to hero, do you mean 1% damage to max hp will result in a 1 point rage increase? I'm not sure what you are referring to yes. That's why most hits to the hero generate very little rage. Hitting creatures generates more because the dmg is a greater percentage of their max hp. It may possibly be closer to say 1:5% on creatures or maybe even 1:100dmg. I'm not sure I know against heroes however, they generate very little rage when you attack them.
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Post by squirreleyez on Sept 1, 2017 18:33:42 GMT
If you're talking about damage taken to hero, do you mean 1% damage to max hp will result in a 1 point rage increase? I'm not sure what you are referring to yes. That's why most hits to the hero generate very little rage. Hitting creatures generates more because the dmg is a greater percentage of their max hp. It may possibly be closer to say 1:5% on creatures or maybe even 1:100dmg. I'm not sure I know against heroes however, they generate very little rage when you attack them. Okay hm. I need to test now if hero health influences rage generation from creatures when they get damaged. If it does, the formula is combining hero and crit hp. If not they'd be separate formulas.
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Post by barleylime on Sept 1, 2017 19:01:47 GMT
I believe the hero rage full bar is 120 rage? I observe that when 2 of my full health creatures die ... example one shot by Taurus. Then my hero will gain rage by half of the rage meter. So my opinion is 1 full health creature is equivalent to about 25% of the rage meter.
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Post by ZanderX10 on Sept 1, 2017 19:20:03 GMT
I believe the hero rage full bar is 120 rage? I observe that when 2 of my full health creatures die ... example one shot by Taurus. Then my hero will gain rage by half of the rage meter. So my opinion is 1 full health creature is equivalent to about 25% of the rage meter. I thought it was 100 rage. If the ratio for creature dmg was 1:100dmg then killing 2 crits with about 2500 hp would still fill the bar halfway.
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Post by Yuna on Sept 1, 2017 22:43:48 GMT
Rage generation formula. Has anybody attempted to figure this out? What factors play into rage generation? The reason why I'm asking this is trying to create a condition where your hero power could still fire off after taking a hit from RQT, for example. There is literally no way in the known universe this will happen if you that you mean that Queen Temptress is the last creature to hit the hero. There's is no way to get Queen Temptress generate 20% rage unless you're using a high level Summoning hero (like Berserker). What goes into determining how much rage is given out when hit by damage: Amount of damage taken vs. amount of Max HP on the creature/hero hit. That's it. A creature with 1500 HP taking 1000 damage will generate more rage than a creature with 10000 HP taking 1000 damage.
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#830909
Boxing Kangaroo
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BK✦Singing
Friendly and fun guild. Share experience & enjoy the game together.
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Post by BK✦Singing on Sept 1, 2017 23:41:44 GMT
Rage generation formula. Has anybody attempted to figure this out? What factors play into rage generation? The reason why I'm asking this is trying to create a condition where your hero power could still fire off after taking a hit from RQT, for example. There is literally no way in the known universe this will happen if you that you mean that Queen Temptress is the last creature to hit the hero. There's is no way to get Queen Temptress generate 20% rage unless you're using a high level Summoning hero (like Berserker). Not just summoner or not, the order matters. IIRC the 20 reduction happens after hero gaining rage.
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Post by barleylime on Sept 2, 2017 1:51:29 GMT
I believe the hero rage full bar is 120 rage? I observe that when 2 of my full health creatures die ... example one shot by Taurus. Then my hero will gain rage by half of the rage meter. So my opinion is 1 full health creature is equivalent to about 25% of the rage meter. I thought it was 100 rage. If the ratio for creature dmg was 1:100dmg then killing 2 crits with about 2500 hp would still fill the bar halfway. I remember back in the day when QT Osmose was 30 rage, I would see the rage meter reduced by a quarter. Hence my assumption that a full meter is 120 rage. It does not matter how much is the crit HP. If the crit HP is 800 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will increase 30 rage (ie 25%). If the HP crit is 4000 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will also increase 30 rage (ie 25%). Hence the claim "the rage increase is based on the percentage of health lost by the crit" If the crit loses 50% health, then the rage meter would increase by 15 rage (ie 12.5%). If the crit loses 20% health, then the rage meter would increase by 6 rage (ie 5%) Disclaimer: The above is just my observation. It has not been tested.
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Post by jp on Sept 2, 2017 3:57:38 GMT
I remember back in the day when QT Osmose was 30 rage, I would see the rage meter reduced by a quarter. Hence my assumption that a full meter is 120 rage. It does not matter how much is the crit HP. If the crit HP is 800 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will increase 30 rage (ie 25%). If the HP crit is 4000 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will also increase 30 rage (ie 25%). Hence the claim "the rage increase is based on the percentage of health lost by the crit" If the crit loses 50% health, then the rage meter would increase by 15 rage (ie 12.5%). If the crit loses 20% health, then the rage meter would increase by 6 rage (ie 5%) Disclaimer: The above is just my observation. It has not been tested. Besides the HP % theory, I think each successful attack also generates a bonus rage, my main acct uses Berserk/Warhungry and it can do 500k+ damage without triggering hero skill vs my Alt acct that uses a full heal deck, today, it did (130k or 200k can't remember) but it triggered the hero skill twice. Because my alt had to hit the enemy so many times thats why i think it generated much more rage from so many successful attacks, another example is spiky bits, by doing just around a 100k damage it can trigger the hero skill 2 to 3 times.
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Post by barleylime on Sept 2, 2017 4:36:15 GMT
I remember back in the day when QT Osmose was 30 rage, I would see the rage meter reduced by a quarter. Hence my assumption that a full meter is 120 rage. It does not matter how much is the crit HP. If the crit HP is 800 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will increase 30 rage (ie 25%). If the HP crit is 4000 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will also increase 30 rage (ie 25%). Hence the claim "the rage increase is based on the percentage of health lost by the crit" If the crit loses 50% health, then the rage meter would increase by 15 rage (ie 12.5%). If the crit loses 20% health, then the rage meter would increase by 6 rage (ie 5%) Disclaimer: The above is just my observation. It has not been tested. Besides the HP % theory, I think each successful attack also generates a bonus rage, my main acct uses Berserk/Warhungry and it can do 500k+ damage without triggering hero skill vs my Alt acct that uses a full heal deck, today, it did (130k or 200k can't remember) but it triggered the hero skill twice. Because my alt had to hit the enemy so many times thats why i think it generated much more rage from so many successful attacks, another example is spiky bits, by doing just around a 100k damage it can trigger the hero skill 2 to 3 times. I guess how much rage it generates depends on the enemy max HP? Just curious... how is it possible to trigger hero skill twice on the same round?
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Post by jp on Sept 2, 2017 4:54:10 GMT
I guess how much rage it generates depends on the enemy max HP? Just curious... how is it possible to trigger hero skill twice on the same round? oh no, not the same round but the entire fight, my example is for the Guild Map so enemy max Hp are the same, Berserk/Warhungry deck doing more damage but generates less rage then a full healing deck that does much less damage but generates more rage overall. Sorry, wasn't clear about it being the Guild map fight, I thought you might understood it by mentioning 100k, 500k damage.
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Post by ZanderX10 on Sept 2, 2017 6:02:37 GMT
I guess how much rage it generates depends on the enemy max HP? Just curious... how is it possible to trigger hero skill twice on the same round? oh no, not the same round but the entire fight, my example is for the Guild Map so enemy max Hp are the same, Berserk/Warhungry deck doing more damage but generates less rage then a full healing deck that does much less damage but generates more rage overall. Sorry, wasn't clear about it being the Guild map fight, I thought you might understood it by mentioning 100k, 500k damage. guild map heroes gain rage uber slow already. Hero and crit max hp are through the roof.
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Post by Yuna on Sept 2, 2017 6:41:56 GMT
I thought it was 100 rage. If the ratio for creature dmg was 1:100dmg then killing 2 crits with about 2500 hp would still fill the bar halfway. I remember back in the day when QT Osmose was 30 rage, I would see the rage meter reduced by a quarter. Hence my assumption that a full meter is 120 rage. It does not matter how much is the crit HP. If the crit HP is 800 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will increase 30 rage (ie 25%). If the HP crit is 4000 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will also increase 30 rage (ie 25%). Hence the claim "the rage increase is based on the percentage of health lost by the crit" If the crit loses 50% health, then the rage meter would increase by 15 rage (ie 12.5%). If the crit loses 20% health, then the rage meter would increase by 6 rage (ie 5%) Disclaimer: The above is just my observation. It has not been tested. That's because it originally shaved off 30% rage, but then IGG did something to screw it up and it started doing 25%, but they refused to admit to their mistake despite my multiple bug reports and insisted everything was working as intended. So they neither fixed it so it did 30% again, nor did they fix the skill description to read 25% instead of 30%. And both of those things cannot be true. 800 damage cannot dish out the same amount of rage to a creature with 800 Max HP and a creature with 4000 Max HP, yet also only give out 30% rage if either is killed when at max HP. So, clearly, Max HP matters. It appears you might be right about the 30% rage part going by eye measurement, but Max HP clearly matters. You can easily check this by watching any Deck Heroes video/match (like this one: www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwWARXpDlGE at 19:15), where exact same amount of damage dished out to a Queen Temptress will net you a lot more rage than the exact same amount of damage dished out to, say, sacrifice!Soul Shrew. It appears you're just expressing yourself badly, not using bad logic, however. So what we can say that rage gain is roughly 30% divided by creature's Max HP times amount of damage inflicted. When it comes to hero damage, that's much harder to ascertain.
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Post by barleylime on Sept 2, 2017 7:15:42 GMT
I remember back in the day when QT Osmose was 30 rage, I would see the rage meter reduced by a quarter. Hence my assumption that a full meter is 120 rage. It does not matter how much is the crit HP. If the crit HP is 800 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will increase 30 rage (ie 25%). If the HP crit is 4000 and it gets killed (from full health to zero), the rage meter will also increase 30 rage (ie 25%). Hence the claim "the rage increase is based on the percentage of health lost by the crit" If the crit loses 50% health, then the rage meter would increase by 15 rage (ie 12.5%). If the crit loses 20% health, then the rage meter would increase by 6 rage (ie 5%) Disclaimer: The above is just my observation. It has not been tested. That's because it originally shaved off 30% rage, but then IGG did something to screw it up and it started doing 25%, but they refused to admit to their mistake despite my multiple bug reports and insisted everything was working as intended. So they neither fixed it so it did 30% again, nor did they fix the skill description to read 25% instead of 30%. And both of those things cannot be true. 800 damage cannot dish out the same amount of rage to a creature with 800 Max HP and a creature with 4000 Max HP, yet also only give out 30% rage if either is killed when at max HP. So, clearly, Max HP matters. It appears you might be right about the 30% rage part going by eye measurement, but Max HP clearly matters. You can easily check this by watching any Deck Heroes video/match (like this one: www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwWARXpDlGE at 19:15), where exact same amount of damage dished out to a Queen Temptress will net you a lot more rage than the exact same amount of damage dished out to, say, sacrifice!Soul Shrew. It appears you're just expressing yourself badly, not using bad logic, however. So what we can say that rage gain is roughly 30% divided by creature's Max HP times amount of damage inflicted. When it comes to hero damage, that's much harder to ascertain. What I mean is: If crit is full 800hp and you attack 800hp = 25% rage generated. If crit is full 4000hp and you attack 4000hp = 25% rage generated. If crit is full 4000hp and you attack 800hp = 800/4000 x 25% = 5% rage generated. If you enemy has 2 crit (800hp & 4000hp) and your Sac Taurus deals 8000 damage kiiling both instantly = 50% rage generated. Edit: rage meter points.
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Post by barleylime on Sept 2, 2017 7:30:32 GMT
I checked map 16-10. Hanzo level 10 Concealed Strike rune = lose 50 rage, and the rage meter is reduced by half or 50%. So this would suggest the rage meter is 100 points and not 120 as I had stated earlier. Hopes this clarifies.
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Post by Yuna on Sept 2, 2017 9:14:14 GMT
I checked map 16-10. Hanzo level 10 Concealed Strike rune = lose 50 rage, and the rage meter is reduced by half or 50%. So this would suggest the rage meter is 100 points and not 120 as I had stated earlier. Hopes this clarifies. Yes. We knew this already. I already explained why you were wrong.
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Post by squirreleyez on Sept 4, 2017 22:50:42 GMT
That's because it originally shaved off 30% rage, but then IGG did something to screw it up and it started doing 25%, but they refused to admit to their mistake despite my multiple bug reports and insisted everything was working as intended. So they neither fixed it so it did 30% again, nor did they fix the skill description to read 25% instead of 30%. And both of those things cannot be true. 800 damage cannot dish out the same amount of rage to a creature with 800 Max HP and a creature with 4000 Max HP, yet also only give out 30% rage if either is killed when at max HP. So, clearly, Max HP matters. It appears you might be right about the 30% rage part going by eye measurement, but Max HP clearly matters. You can easily check this by watching any Deck Heroes video/match (like this one: www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwWARXpDlGE at 19:15), where exact same amount of damage dished out to a Queen Temptress will net you a lot more rage than the exact same amount of damage dished out to, say, sacrifice!Soul Shrew. It appears you're just expressing yourself badly, not using bad logic, however. So what we can say that rage gain is roughly 30% divided by creature's Max HP times amount of damage inflicted. When it comes to hero damage, that's much harder to ascertain. What I mean is: If crit is full 800hp and you attack 800hp = 25% rage generated. If crit is full 4000hp and you attack 4000hp = 25% rage generated. If crit is full 4000hp and you attack 800hp = 800/4000 x 25% = 5% rage generated. If you enemy has 2 crit (800hp & 4000hp) and your Sac Taurus deals 8000 damage kiiling both instantly = 50% rage generated. Edit: rage meter points. Interesting! So if this is right, the best strategy for firing off hero power rapidly is to use low hp creatures. Finding those low hp creatures (+melds) with the most effectiveness is my new quest.
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Post by squirreleyez on Sept 4, 2017 22:57:38 GMT
Rage generation formula. Has anybody attempted to figure this out? What factors play into rage generation? The reason why I'm asking this is trying to create a condition where your hero power could still fire off after taking a hit from RQT, for example. There is literally no way in the known universe this will happen if you that you mean that Queen Temptress is the last creature to hit the hero. There's is no way to get Queen Temptress generate 20% rage unless you're using a high level Summoning hero (like Berserker). What goes into determining how much rage is given out when hit by damage: Amount of damage taken vs. amount of Max HP on the creature/hero hit. That's it. A creature with 1500 HP taking 1000 damage will generate more rage than a creature with 10000 HP taking 1000 damage. I see what you are saying, meaning it's impossible to have hero power go off from the damage of RQT alone hitting your hero. But, sacrifice, maybe other creature skills I do not yet know about... I'm just giving an example here of how it could be important and useful the know the rage gen formula.
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Post by Yuna on Sept 5, 2017 4:15:14 GMT
There is literally no way in the known universe this will happen if you that you mean that Queen Temptress is the last creature to hit the hero. There's is no way to get Queen Temptress generate 20% rage unless you're using a high level Summoning hero (like Berserker). What goes into determining how much rage is given out when hit by damage: Amount of damage taken vs. amount of Max HP on the creature/hero hit. That's it. A creature with 1500 HP taking 1000 damage will generate more rage than a creature with 10000 HP taking 1000 damage. I see what you are saying, meaning it's impossible to have hero power go off from the damage of RQT alone hitting your hero. But, sacrifice, maybe other creature skills I do not yet know about... I'm just giving an example here of how it could be important and useful the know the rage gen formula. No, it is literally impossible through that because the rage drains happens after the damage and rage gain from Queen Temptress' Basic Attack takes place.
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Post by jp on Sept 5, 2017 4:36:03 GMT
This is true from what i have seen the last few days, the problem is you have to be able to get them back and keep the tormentor off the enemies field.
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Post by squirreleyez on Sept 5, 2017 10:38:40 GMT
I see what you are saying, meaning it's impossible to have hero power go off from the damage of RQT alone hitting your hero. But, sacrifice, maybe other creature skills I do not yet know about... I'm just giving an example here of how it could be important and useful the know the rage gen formula. No, it is literally impossible through that because the rage drains happens after the damage and rage gain from Queen Temptress' Basic Attack takes place. I already agreed to this, even though it wasn't the point of my post. Thanks though.
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Post by nemesisdestroyer on Sept 6, 2017 10:53:49 GMT
Rage generation was helpfull for me, to decide what lvl of Voodoo rune I needed for my Voodoo Q.T.! So if its on end deny Hero skill, without basic attack fill rage to full again! xD
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