inherit
148
0
203
bigstab [NFS]
nope.com
328
Mar 13, 2015 14:47:35 GMT
March 2015
bigstab
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Post by bigstab [NFS] on Apr 21, 2015 16:59:39 GMT
Just something that has always bugged me. Especially with Dahlia, there is minimal downside to her sacrificing a creature to then bring it back right away. I mean the concept is that they are consuming a creature to gain strength. Not much of a consumption if it can be countered with rebirth, revive, recycle, undying and god knows what.
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inherit
17
0
Dec 25, 2020 19:33:11 GMT
1,077
ÐARҞNESS
Mass confusion >>>
1,424
Feb 12, 2015 12:26:07 GMT
February 2015
zachs
102
NFS
Example 3
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Post by ÐARҞNESS on Apr 21, 2015 17:05:00 GMT
Sacrifice was designed with all this in place.. hence it sacrifices a random creature. It could kill off your recycler, your revive, whatever it feels like, if it kills off a card, there isn't always a chance for it to come back. I'd say it's good as is, can only be stronger in manual combat.
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40
0
Jun 28, 2022 14:01:22 GMT
409
Pyron
637
Feb 18, 2015 22:18:35 GMT
February 2015
pyron
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Post by Pyron on Apr 21, 2015 17:53:23 GMT
Well we need some combo wombos! Well Dahlia would recycle the critter anyway, so not triggering the rebirth proc would not solve this sacrifice dilemma. Now you mean to literally remove the creature from the game, I think it would make Sacrifice too weak as the bonus isn't that great. Dahlia itself is rather weak by herself.
They could make a different mechanic with a permanent removal of the graveyard for a greater bonus.
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0
Apr 19, 2016 16:28:56 GMT
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dbreezy✪NFS
185
March 2015
dbreezy
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Post by dbreezy✪NFS on Apr 21, 2015 18:20:03 GMT
It's just very poor game design. Like, with dhalia its ok I think cause it's a combo unique to her and is part of what makes her good. However, rebirth being able to proc through sacrifice is just stupid and OP. completely negates the "downside" to sacrificing and can sometimes be a boon (see siren, death knight, etc). Sacrifice NEEDS to negate the effect of rebirth imo.
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17
0
Dec 25, 2020 19:33:11 GMT
1,077
ÐARҞNESS
Mass confusion >>>
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Feb 12, 2015 12:26:07 GMT
February 2015
zachs
102
NFS
Example 3
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Post by ÐARҞNESS on Apr 21, 2015 18:45:08 GMT
Then no one will use sacrifice, lmao
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Apr 19, 2016 16:28:56 GMT
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dbreezy✪NFS
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March 2015
dbreezy
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Post by dbreezy✪NFS on Apr 21, 2015 18:57:46 GMT
I don't really think that's true. A grabboid with sacrifice will ALWAYS be good no matter what you sacrifice. I see your point though...it would be a deterrent and i think it SHOULD be due to it's extreme power in comparison to other skills.
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paulus
Nightraider
Exalted
Posts: 62
inherit
Exalted
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24
paulus
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Mar 11, 2015 12:53:16 GMT
March 2015
paulus
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Post by paulus on Apr 21, 2015 19:24:53 GMT
how about reducing dahlia's recycle to just 1....why allow her to not only sacrifice, buff her attack and defense so she is tough to take out in a round or 2, then she brings back a pile of creatures while you whittle away her sacrificed health. Why not sacrifice and the card is destroyed? She still gets the buff and she can still recycle what is already in the grave.....
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Royal
89
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Jul 28, 2016 18:48:00 GMT
231
thundergod
396
March 2015
thundergod
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Post by thundergod on Apr 21, 2015 23:20:58 GMT
Sacrifice is fine. I also think it adds good strategy to balance your deck around benefitting from sacrifice. As it is now, most of the best cards don't have rebirth anyway.
Also, Dahlia really isn't all that special of a recycle 2 card compared to some other choices for melding.
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#0d6ad6
Human Deck Specialist
86
0
Sept 26, 2015 19:32:03 GMT
1,691
DianaTroy [βκ]
In-Game Names: DianaTroy_[BK] & BevCrusher_[BK]
2,861
March 2015
dianatroy
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Post by DianaTroy [βκ] on Apr 21, 2015 23:27:39 GMT
Sacrifice should negate Rebirth, simple as that.
The whole strength of Dahlia is that she beefs up and keeps cards alive. I find nothing wrong with her Recycling back whatever she Sacrificed.
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marty0087
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Post by ℳarty on Apr 21, 2015 23:55:39 GMT
Im fine with the way sacrifice work as of now and since the skill is farmable, its fair for anyone, even f2p. If you fell like sacrifice is op, use it yourself on daihla, venom tyrant or even better, meld it on a graboid for a killer card.
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Jun 28, 2022 14:01:22 GMT
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Pyron
637
Feb 18, 2015 22:18:35 GMT
February 2015
pyron
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Post by Pyron on Apr 22, 2015 7:17:03 GMT
Sacrifice 8 is only great because of Graboid combination of Stoneskin and Sweeping Blow (also the anti-human bonus sometimes comes up) which guarantee some value back with one big hit and may take out of your opponents cards. Otherwise, it's 1-for-2 effect in a game with only 10 cards. In a different non-Immunity/Stoneskin creature, you will be open to a 1-for-3 situation like we all like to do with Instakill against explore maps.
If Sacrifice had a line like "this effects negates rebirth", it would make it unnecessarily weak. Rebirth + Sacrifice combo isn't that powerful of a combo. You lose a bit of tempo and Graboid can be still locked down or stopped by a FA creature.
I rather have these combos in game.
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ℜoyal
259
0
567
ℜ★Jaegybomb
Hey, turn me back around.
1,987
April 2015
jaegybomb
Example 2
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Post by ℜ★Jaegybomb on Apr 22, 2015 7:37:06 GMT
You said what I was going to only better.
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#0d6ad6
Human Deck Specialist
86
0
Sept 26, 2015 19:32:03 GMT
1,691
DianaTroy [βκ]
In-Game Names: DianaTroy_[BK] & BevCrusher_[BK]
2,861
March 2015
dianatroy
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Post by DianaTroy [βκ] on Apr 22, 2015 15:25:20 GMT
Sacrifice 8 is only great because of Graboid combination of Stoneskin and Sweeping Blow (also the anti-human bonus sometimes comes up) which guarantee some value back with one big hit and may take out of your opponents cards. Otherwise, it's 1-for-2 effect in a game with only 10 cards. In a different non-Immunity/Stoneskin creature, you will be open to a 1-for-3 situation like we all like to do with Instakill against explore maps. If Sacrifice had a line like "this effects negates rebirth", it would make it unnecessarily weak. Rebirth + Sacrifice combo isn't that powerful of a combo. You lose a bit of tempo and Graboid can be still locked down or stopped by a FA creature. I rather have these combos in game. I love dropping a Frost Rager with Block 7 in front of a Sacrifice Graboid. 15 DMG!
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Apr 19, 2016 16:28:56 GMT
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dbreezy✪NFS
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March 2015
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Post by dbreezy✪NFS on Apr 22, 2015 15:47:12 GMT
I completely disagree that rebirth/sacrifice isn't a powerful combo and would also dispute tempo loss. Many times the sacrifice creature comes in a kills a creature instantly due to the extreme attack boost. Not only this but there are many times where the sacrificed creature already has minimal HP and yet you still get the massive boosts. Add to this something like sacrificing Siren and you actually get a tempo GAIN due to activating seals multiple times. Sacrifice negating rebirth wouldn't make it weak at all imo. For one, it wouldn't even really effect dhalia since she has rebirth and for grabboid, it hits everything for like...1400atk and will live for multiple turns. I would most certainly not call that weak. I would say hitting everything for 1400 and then playing the creature you sacrificed 1 or 2 turns later is incredibly overpowered and extremely difficult to play around.
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Pyron
637
Feb 18, 2015 22:18:35 GMT
February 2015
pyron
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Post by Pyron on Apr 22, 2015 16:03:09 GMT
Like I say, let's say you get your Thalassa sacrificed? You lose a huge tempo for this. Even a sacrificed and rebirthed Death Knight is a tempo loss as small as it is. Also, I see those sacrifice Graboids in non-undying decks as well with minimal rebirth (just recycle). If it lands on a recycle critter, it would be a huge loss. Still the bonus is worthy the tempo loss, but it's not a game breaking advantage.
I never said it's weak. It's a nice combo we have in this game. Nothing more than that. So having a cute interaction with those other creatures is nice.
Now I don't think it's hard to play around. Just look at these explore maps. These maps are easier than they look. Also, if you have the choice in the matter in card placement, you should be able to deal with it unless your deck is totally unprepared to it. But realistically, what is that situation? It would be guild maps, but these are random enough that this combo wouldn't matter. The interaction would happen at random. Sacrifice has to give some awesome value in exchange of the risk of 1-for-2. Otherwise, it would be a pointless ability.
Also, in arena I don't see the divide in people having Graboids w/ Sacrifice and people who don't. Maybe in new arenas it may be powerful, but at older arenas, only the mid section will use this. The rest will use the true and tested Stonekin/Disposal and shitton of lvl 15 5*. In my Arena it's more about people who have revive or not than that.
I wish I could see more people around my level (70s) using Graboids w Sac 8 in Gauntlet. Sometimes those Tyrants don't cut it if they have timer 6 creatures.
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